If you are a furry who's been put on the sex offender registry over a mistake you regret and don't do anymore, especially if such mistake was not violent and far more less preferred, and wish to be accepted as a person and want to find advice through legal messages, one of the things you should avoid is Askpapabear (http://www.askpapabear.com/).
___________
Some Effects of Some Sexual Record History
There are several family members and friends who has suffered due to prejudice and other insane effects caused toward victims of the sex offender registry and/or other negative things toward many people all because of a long regretted past. Reports of suicides strongly exist, depressions continue to exist from people who has done wrong but regret, and close friends and family has suffered because of these negative unfair consequences forced upon many of those who regret.
Not only this, but the sex offender registry has caused harassment and even the worst crime of all which was unlawful killing.
Some people who are on it may also be furries who are strongly wishing to move on and be happy in life for legal following reasons, and even some of those may be very young. It is horrible, and disgusting, and just as bad as violent child sexual abuse to treat a young person like crap because of a past mistake when the person who is suffering is supposed to get legal help.
It is extremely disgusting to force a person to be alone by never allowing them to make friends and be part of a legal community.
Papabear likely doesn't accept furries who regret and consider them to be less important than those with a "clean" record.
___________
The Disturbing Comments
Papabear's comment:
As a private entity, FC has the right to limit access to its convention, as long as doing so is not based on race, religion, sex, gender, nationality, etc. Banning someone with a criminal record falls in line with, say, an employer not hiring someone because they have such a record. I support FC's decision in this matter."I support FC's decision in this matter."
Reply to such comment:
No offense Papa Bear, but I had a lot of faith in you being open and accepting. If you support making people lose their jobs and/or never be happy in life because of a record while it's possible a lot of those people changed, then you have completely lost a follower of your blog.Papabear's reply:
I thought you were open and accepting? But if you support making people lose their jobs and/or never be happy again in life legally, then I can no longer support you.
I believe that the company has a right to remove someone, but you're saying that directly to something that is directly not allowing it rather than "may". That's what I mean.
You are not getting what I'm saying. How can you lose a job you never had? An employer has the right not to hire someone with a felony record. If I were an employer myself, I would not deny someone just on the basis of their past record. A lot of things come into account. Now, in the case of FC's policy, we are discussing violent criminal records, such as murder, rape, and pedophilia. You might not be aware of this, but the criminal justice system does not have a great track record for rehabilitating people. Indeed, people who go to prison are often worse for the experience. Add to this that a number of furcons have had to close because of attendee misbehavior, thus ruining conventions for everyone, and I agree that convention organizers have a right to be picky about who comes to their events. Another example. Here in Palm Springs, there used to be biker rallies allowed. Biker gangs would come here, drink, and often get violent. This happened year after year until the city said, "No more." Is it unforgiving and closed-minded to not let the bikers back to the city to cause pain and mayhem?Replies to such comment:
No offense, "Anon," but you don't get it. Sorry I lost you as a reader. Sounds like you need to keep reading it.
I'm not very upset at you for saying they merely have a right to ban people for such record reason. Heck, I think they have a right to ban people for any reason legally. If they ban furries for wearing a pink fursuit, they have the right. Is it a stupid reason? It could be argued as "yes", but they still have a right. Though of course, people are allowed to legally criticize it.
I'm upset because you merely said "I support FC's decision in this matter.", like you agree with the rule itself being right, as in, the proper answer or "morally right". And that you may even have hinted at supporting the idea that anyone with a past record should never get a job.
And posting the comment here where the article was kinda wondering if this rule should be accepted as in the right answer or not maybe.
To add another reply, let me address your other main point.Papa Bear's Reply to Last Part or Maybe Both
Yes, a lot of bad things happen at furcons, but that doesn't mean we should by default ban every single person from the place just because of a bad record involving sex crimes, and not all sex crimes were violent. And I'm pretty sure I was focusing on that alone, not every single record. Though "pedophile" is merely attraction, I assume you mean child sexual abuse?
I believe in legaly protection of any legal furcon. But it would be far better if they were being more realistic on any person instead of including a ban that automatically includes those that actually changed. It would be better if this was more about certain recent people for example.
If someone, with or without a criminal record of a sexual offense has had a recent history illegal sexual behavior or some very suspicious activity that wasn't alone illegal, I would be more in support banning that person from entering because it's very likely the person is gonna cause trouble.
If someone, with a criminal record of a sexual offense, especially if such offense was small especially if based off at a young age, completed a necessary sentence and has had no history of bad behavior, still dreamed of a carrier, and was denied because of a past mistake, that just isn't good. This paragraph is what I'm more on the topic is. If you were truly supporting a rule that goes that broad to include those that really are not monsters forever, that's where I felt betrayed in terms of trust..
I'm sorry, but you actually expect the furcon admins to spend hours, days, weeks evaluating cases to see whether or not they merit consideration for entrance to a con after having been jailed for a sex offense? That is unrealistic. You apparently have no idea how busy these people are to organize a con. It is more important to protect the integrity of the con and the safety of its NON-criminal attendees than it is to protect the feelings of a couple people who have been found guilty of a serious crime.
Do some people change their ways? Yes, that happens. More often than not, however, sex offenders and people guilty of violent crimes such as assault and murder have serious mental and emotional issues that require the treatment of trained professionals. It is unfair to insist that furcon admins deal with this. They are not social workers, they are not the police, they are not psychiatrists.
If you're so offended by convention rules, the answer is simple: don't go to the convention.
The five main things:
- His "I support FC's decision in this matter." message did not look like as it's to the possibility right to ban, but rather, it was for the rule itself which also exposes this as a "moral good" decision to yet many other furcons, and many other jobs.
- his likely delusion that people with no record are "more important" with consideration that legal effort of those with past mistakes are a "waste" but isn't for those with no bad past. That is extremely disgusting of him to say!
- And not only that, but he has literally reacted against the criticism that a company can have some work to help trust certain people.
- Plus, it's likely clear he treat "criminals", even those that ALREADY payed for their crimes as a different.
- And finally, he acts as if every sex offender has serious mental issues and compared all of them to terrible crimes.
Update 12/26/2018: Due to further comments. It's very clear that my prediction of this person being a closed minded and non-accepting person is true now. Same with maybe some of my other claims. Once again, a negative prediction is correct maybe. There may still be updates without "Update". Update Done
__________
Did PapaBear Violate Trust Involving Privacy?
Update 12/26/2018: Never mind, according to a comment by the same name, the comment partly meant a possible comment on Flayrah.com somewhere. Update Done
__________
GO TO A REAL EXPERT LEGALLY AUTHORIZED
Even Papabear himself said he's just for entertainment and not for the following:
I'm sick of this. Just please stop calling me a troll.
ReplyDeleteSo to address my so-called claim of "WORSE THAN A CHILD MOLESTER" thing. Sometimes I might go too far with this, but when I do compare, why exactly do I do that?
First of all, I'm one of those rational people who hates it when people look at "child molestation" to be the worst thing by default. Yes, child molestation is bad, but there are degrees too. I've been on the look to realize that many cases of such horrible act should not be compared to worse acts done to a child. There are likely of non-violent touching and then there is violent touching. In many cases of both being bad, one of them is worse likely.
Now second, the effects of child molestation might also depend on the victim, and the effect of one. The main argument in my opinion is the effect of the person's life in the future.
In the past I've might of said some people where worse than certain child molesters and sometimes I compare some people to those who merely want to molest a child, which are different things.
There are some people who supports the legal death penalty for mere molestation (way too far) and/or other things that ruin a person's life. Anyone who supports any life threatening thing outside of child molestation shall be compared to those that molest children in some degrees.
And anyone who only believes in anything that ruins a person's life shall be compared to those who only want to molest children.
So the justice is this: If you steal something valuable that legally belongs to someone, you have stole the person's important property. If you, as a victim of such offense went in and stole something exactly as valuable of his or her's legal property, then you're just as bad.
___________
Now, while I went too far to merely say "he's worse than a child molester" toward Papabear and if I said it, I believe it may depend on his effect to another person's life.
In the theory of Papabear supporting legal furry communities kicking anyone out for any offense in the past that such person no longer does.
The same goes for Papabear destroying the hopes of a ex offender furry trying to seek forgiveness and then blaming the furry as if the one who denies forgivness has no fault (which he clearly supported).
Due to some other forms of hurtful comments that Papabear has posted, and the two main followings, this is why I compare him in some cases, while I apologize for beings wrongly broad at the same time.
My comparison is not trolling, I'm comparing him because he supports things that creates harm to many people who's no longer bad people.
If it's hard to justify my comparison because of issues involving "rights being violated", I still say he's been hurtful to a lot of people online. Especially when in theory, "suicide thoughts" may forcefully come to people's mind with little to no control due to the conduct that has been denied.
ReplyDeleteLet's make up a fictional example:
Palli is a furry and has committed a serious offense at the age of 19. In one case, the person has taken 10 years with 3 years probation, and was put on the sex offender registry for life. Yet, Palli at that time likely had mental issues or didn't but regardless the person has learned so easily and changed, perhaps even the moment the person got arrested and heard the sentence.
Later, Palli was released early due to good behavior and has finished 3 years probation after parole. The person was still forced to enter the sex offender registry even though the person completed the sentence. The person wanted to move on, out of deep remorse. After, many people anyway denied Palli, almost everywhere. Families, friends and many furry community (closed minded) denied such person even though the person has actually changed. Palli wanted to come back and continue being happy with furry friends.
Part 2 In Other Comment.
Fictional Story Continues:
DeleteAfter a year of this, and with jobs also denying Palli, Palli was forced alone to suffer. New mental mindsets came in and the person was completely open to committing suicide. At this point, the person had little to no hope. The person remembered a site called Askpapabear.com, and wrote the following letter to him:
"Dear Papa Bear, I am suffering from huge depression where all I think of is killing myself. I have made a terrible mistake that I barely remember, and such offense was enough where I was sent to prison for a while, and put on the sex offender registry for life. I've completed my sentence, and I have learned from my mistake to never do it again. Heck, I barely remember what I did, and it wasn't even a preference. I have cried, and cried. After I was released, and did all my work, I wanted to seek forgiveness and continue my carrier with my close friends and family.
But I was denied, treated like a horrible being even though I'm not the same person anymore. I dream of my legal dreams, but people harass me, treat me like crap, and many jobs deny me. I just wanted to come back to my furry community or at least find some new ones to help me be happy again, so I was wondering if you knew any advice?
I am hurt deeply, and I've changed. I'm not a monster today.
===Reply===
I'm sorry Palli, but I cannot help you. You committed an offense that is likely not forgotten. You shouldn't be asking any furry community to forgive you. Your actions has consequences and it's 100% your fault when those furries have refused to accept you as who you are. I think it's better if you don't speak to me about this again, and try to seek forgiveness from your family instead. I know you want to move on in the furry fandom, but I support furry communities never accepting you in ever again as I care more about those who are perfect.
===No Reply===
NEWS: Palli Marth dies at 33 through suicide.
Palli Marth has had a history of depression due to harassment and not being accepted by jobs, communities, friends, and families all because many people knew his or her mistake. The person was put on the sex offender registry for life, even though the person was said to have changed. Experts say the suicide happened by Palli tying himself to train tracks at night and then a train hit him.
On the side of the train tracks of where the suicide took place, there was a suicide note taped onto the lower rail that reads:
"I am sorry for everything. I've changed, but the world refuses to accept me and treats me like I'm still a horrible monster. I just wanted to move on as a changed person, but I wasn't allowed to. This isn't justice and I wish I could have a carrier and be happy in communities. Nobody liked me anymore, I've even sent a letter to a person I've trusted, but even that person turned me down and blamed me for not being forgiven. After that, I had only suicide thoughts with no hope of forgiveness from my own dream. So I've decided to end my life for good. Soon I will be free, and those horrible people will not be in heaven with me. I will be happy with possibly a new society who will smile, and see me as a new person. Good bye, forever. - Palli Marth
Fictional Story Over.
Edit: nvm
DeleteYour idealism of a forgiving society wont help, because, we don't know if A.) They will strike again. B.) They have become worst
Have you read this? The last replythey give to you?:
DeleteIt is more important to protect the integrity of the con and the safety of its NON-criminal attendees than it is to protect the feelings of a couple people who have been found guilty of a serious crime.
Do some people change their ways? Yes, that happens. More often than not, however, sex offenders and people guilty of violent crimes such as assault and murder have serious mental and emotional issues that require the treatment of trained professionals. It is unfair to insist that furcon admins deal with this. They are not social workers, they are not the police, they are not psychiatrists.
"Your idealism of a forgiving society wont help, because, we don't know if A.) They will strike again. B.) They have become worst"
DeleteThat is a terrible argument and mainly because it's hypocritical.
A. We do not know for sure, but this applies to everyone else in the world. We don't know the exact future. If a criminal has evidence of remorse, then we need to accept that they are no different than an innocent and any future offense must be treated as a first time offense.
B. We don't know if someone who already went through remorse are worse. There is no evidence.
____
Other comment: It is not unfair. There has been a history of some offenders (e.g. some sex offenders) getting proper help already and there is evidence that some has changed. And even then, it's possible a con can still moderate even if a mental problem isn't cured (because some can in fact, control some).
Some also change on their own. And there are friends and family that can too. Also, not all sex offenders are violent.
And because all ex-offenders are people too, they are just as important (as basic human being), so it's clearly not unfair to allow those with evidence of remorse and control in.
DeleteRemember, there are several stories where social isolation has happened to those who clearly has changed (e.g. a specific CP case) with a lot of evidence, and committed suicide due to the effects of society. That effect is NOT fair, and anyone who isolate from a lawful area just for that shouldn't even own a fur con and should probably be in prison because they are participating into something with a history that links a lot with suicide, and probably worse. You're idea of not forgiving when it is in fact possible some are changing and trying to be happy lawfully is disgusting and can be compared to some abusers in the first offense.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDelete